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Top 50 - Arab States [2020]

 
 
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Author nfmungard
Partaker
#31 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 14:22 
Jurre:
Full name of site: Kerma
Country: Sudan

Saw a documentation on Arte on this one. Second this.
https://programm.ard.de/TV/Themenschwerpunkte/Dokus--Reportagen/Alle-Dokumentationen/Startseite/?sendung=2872410362005914

Oldest brick building in Africa.

Author Sjobe
Partaker
#32 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 14:29 
nfmungard:
Morocco seems well covered

Morocco and medinas are quite well covered but there is still one that I miss:

The Medina of Chefchaouen
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chefchaouen
https://www.google.fi/search?q=chefchaouen&hl=fi&source=lnms&tbm=isch&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwj6sdq5ttToAhXjkYsKHacoBhMQ_AUoAXoECB4QAw&biw=1448&bih=919

Author Sjobe
Partaker
#33 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 14:33 

Author Assif
Partaker
#34 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 15:39 | Edited by: Assif 
I would like to propose two sites:

Toubkal and Haut-Atlas (Morocco) - both are former TWHS representing the Atlas. IUCN mentioned the Atlas as a gap and so far there have been no natural sites covering it. These sites include its highest peaks and are well protected as national parks.
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parc_national_de_Toubkal
https://fr.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parc_national_du_Haut-Atlas_oriental

Germa (Libya) - a former TWHS, it is the remains of an ancient Berber city which climaxed in the second and third centuries AD. It is an exceptional evidence of ancient settlements in the Sahara.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Germa

Author Assif
Partaker
#35 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 15:44 | Edited by: Assif 
I would like to support:

Sjobe:
Old Dongola (Sudan)

Sjobe:
Tlemcen and its mosques

Sjobe:
Landscape of the city of Constantine

Khuft:
Remains of Abbasid Baghdad

Khuft:
The holy cities of Najaf and Karbala


Author Colvin
Partaker
#36 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 16:38 
Sjobe:
Many of these sites (including Hippo Regius) have been collected to a TWHS Sites, lieux et itineraires augustiniens du Maghreb central.

I was assuming that Nan meant his Historic Annaba nomination to be the same as the Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb (I think there's more nuance in the French, but I don't speak French) TWHS, since he linked to that site with the nomination. If he only wanted to highlight Historic Annaba, would it be repetitive to also put forward the Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb TWHS?

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#37 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 17:29 
Colvin:
I was assuming that Nan meant his Historic Annaba nomination to be the same as the Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb (I think there's more nuance in the French, but I don't speak French) TWHS, since he linked to that site with the nomination. If he only wanted to highlight Historic Annaba, would it be repetitive to also put forward the Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb TWHS?

Yes. Annaba = Augustinian Sites.

I am just not a fan of serial sites. Annaba seems rich in history and seems stronger to me than stringing multiple locations of St. Augustine together. That's why I linked this to the TWHS.

Author Assif
Partaker
#38 | Posted: 6 Apr 2020 18:17 
winterkjm:
Full Name of Site: Great Desert Landscapes - The Qattara Depression & the Great Sand Sea
Country: Egypt

The Great Sand Sea continues on the Libyan side of the border, so maybe this should better a transnational nomination.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Great_Sand_Sea#/media/File:Saharan_topographic_elements_map.png

Author Sjobe
Partaker
#39 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 00:04 | Edited by: Sjobe 
nfmungard:
Yes. Annaba = Augustinian Sites.

OK, but I think "Historic Annaba" would be a totally different site. Augustinian Sites TWHS is just about Roman archaeological sites. Only Hippo Regius / Hippone site is part of it, not anything else in Annaba. And I think Hippo Regius is not even the best that Augustinian Sites TWHS contains.

But well, in this case I support Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb. Still, I'm not sure if the Augustinian context is relevant here. I would call them Roman cities/remains of Eastern Algeria, or something like that.

Author Colvin
Partaker
#40 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 01:32 
Sjobe:
Augustinian Sites TWHS is just about Roman archaeological sites.

The Augustinian sites actually seems to be an attempt by the Algerian government to give more meaning to the collection of Roman sites by tying them together to Augustine of Hippo. I think it makes sense, since it would be more challenging to approve all the sites individually if they were just to focus on their Roman history; there are already several other significant Roman sites in North Africa inscribed on the list. For that, I'm fine with the Augustinian angle to the nomination.

Incidentally, I'd also be fine if the nomination were just limited to Historic Annaba, which with Hippo Regius and Lela Bouna (the Church of St. Augustine) covers the most significant portion of Augustine's life and legacy, as well as the life of the early Christian church.

Author Sjobe
Partaker
#41 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 03:45 | Edited by: Sjobe 
Colvin:
The Augustinian sites actually seems to be an attempt by the Algerian government to give more meaning to the collection of Roman sites by tying them together to Augustine of Hippo.

I agree, this collection of Roman sites needs indeed some context and glue that keeps it together. Augustinian context is fine by me even though it is not that evident for me. In my opinion they should remove some minor sites from that TWHS and focus only on the fewer and better sites, maybe five sites or so.

Author Khuft
Partaker
#42 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 05:35 
Colvin:
collection of Roman sites by tying them together to Augustine of Hippo.

One question I'd have is what is the most defining aspect of these cities - the Roman link, or the early Christian link? St Augustine lived at the very end of the Roman Empire (354-430 AD), he actually died during the siege of Hippo Regius by the Vandals. If the St Augustine link is the key one, I'd expect a site focusing on early churches and the like. If the Roman aspect is more important, I'd look for the traditional Roman monuments. I'm not very familiar with these cities - which aspect would have more OUV potential?

Author warwass
Partaker
#43 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 05:48 
Full Name of the site: Cisterns of Tawila in Aden
Country: Yemen
TWHS: No
Short description: The site consists of a series of tanks of varying shape and capacity. They are connected to one another and located in Wadi Tawila to the southwest of Aden's oldest district, Crater. Originally there were about 53 tanks, but only 13 remain following a succession of renovations, including those done by the British in the 19th century. The existing tanks have a combined capacity of about nineteen million gallons. The tanks were designed to collect and store the rain that flows down from the Shamsan massif through Wadi Tawila, and to protect the city from periodic flooding. The cisterns have been claimed to date back to the 1st century AD, but they may well have been built later by Yemen's earlier Islamic dynasties. (source: Wikipedia)
Criteria: Cultural

And I do support Marib (Yemen), Jerash (Jordan) and Augustinian Sites of the Central Maghreb (Algeria)

Author Jurre
Partaker
#44 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 06:23 
Full name of site: White Desert National Park
Country: Egypt
TWHS?: no
Short description of site: (Wikipedia & Atlas Obscura) White Desert National Park is located in the Farafra depression. The park is the site of large white chalk rock formations. Formed by centuries of erosion and sandstorms, these unique calcium rock formations crop up across the landscape like great abstract statues. It is also the site of cliffs (at the northern end of the Farafra Depression), sand dunes (part of the Great Sand Sea), as well as Wadi Hennis and oases at Ain El Maqfi and Ain El Wadi. The park serves as the refuge for various animals, including the endangered Rhim gazelle and the vulnerable Dorcas gazelle, as well as Barbary sheep; jackals; Rüppell's, Red, and Fennec foxes; and Sand cats.
Criteria: Natural

Author Jurre
Partaker
#45 | Posted: 7 Apr 2020 07:42 
There is so much more in Egypt...

Full name of site: Dendera Temple complex, comprising the Temple of Hator
Country: Egypt
TWHS?: yes (link in title)
Short description of site: (Wikipedia & Atlas Obscura) The Dendera Temple complexis one of the best-preserved temple complexes in Egypt. It displays influences from Egyptian, Greek, and Roman rulers. The whole complex covers some 40,000 square meters and is surrounded by a hefty mudbrick enclosed wall. It seems that pharaoh Pepi I (ca. 2250 BC) built on this site and evidence exists of a temple in the Eighteenth Dynasty (ca. 1500 BC). The earliest extant building in the compound today is the Mammisi raised by Nectanebo II – last of the native pharaohs (360–343 BC). The dominant building in the complex is the Temple of Hathor. The temple has been modified on the same site starting as far back as the Middle Kingdom, and continuing right up until the time of the Roman emperor Trajan. Hathor Temple is the home of a relief sometimes known as the Dendera light because of a controversial fringe thesis about its nature.
Criteria: Cultural

Full name of site: Necropolises of Middle Egypt, from the Middle Empire to the Roman period
Country: Egypt
TWHS?: yes (link in title)
Short description of site: (Wikipedia) The site comprises four necropolises:
1°) necropolises of Beni Hassan and Deir al-Barsha: two necropolises representative of nobiliary tombs of the Middle Empire (2064-1797) in Middle Egypt. They are cemeteries of the governors ("nomarchs") of the nomes (a territorial division) of Egypt.
2°) necropolis of Tell el Amarna, corresponding to the reign of Akhenaton (1348-1331) which only lasted for 17 years but had longlasting consequences and left us with an astonishingly original legacy. The tombs are witnesses of the "art of Amarna", which subsequent pharaohs have tried to eradicate from history.
3°) necropolis of Touna al-Gabal, remarkable for its tombs from the low period with its combination of Greco-Roman and Egyptian art. It was extremely important religious centre from remote antiquity up to the Christian era.
Criteria: Cultural

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