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Author winterkjm
Partaker
#691 | Posted: 9 Aug 2022 03:48 
Thones

Injeongjeon Thone Hall of Changdeokgung (additional information)


Author elsslots
Admin
#692 | Posted: 9 Aug 2022 07:44 
Jurre:
Connection: Tombs

Quedlinburg – "The graves of Heinrich der Vogler (Henry the Fowler), King of East Francia and his wife Mathilda are located in the crypt of the church. Heinrich's grave only contains a battered empty stone coffin; the whereabouts of the king's remains and time and circumstances of their disappearance are unknown." (Wikipedia – Quedlinburg Abbey)

I am not sure this would count as elaborate enough, it looks just like a regular grave within a crypt
(This connection needs to be cleaned up by the way, will put it on my to do-list)

Author elsslots
Admin
#693 | Posted: 9 Aug 2022 07:44 
winterkjm:
"Now the road separating the two historic sites tunnels under a newly created 8,000 sq.m green area with 760 new trees to restore the connection between worldly and spiritual power. The reconnection creates a walking route through the heart of downtown Seoul from Gwanghwamun to Gyeongbok, Changdeok, Changgyeong palaces and Dongdaemun."

Looks very nicely done!

Author Durian
Partaker
#694 | Posted: 17 Aug 2022 03:08 | Edited by: Durian 
Jurre:
nspired by the "Chairs" connection, I would like to propose a "Thrones" connection.

I would like to ask more info on this connection. Is this connection limited to the "Throne" that not easy to move, a bit of permanent structure, not portable like sedan or big royal golden chairs? Like now the criteria is only for originals not reconstructions, you mean the original historical thrones, not a modern replica one? or means the sole original throne that represent sovereign power which normally located in palace's main audience hall, not include those smaller lesser thrones that can be seen in other lesser palace hall that reconstruct as symbolic thrones?

Author elsslots
Admin
#695 | Posted: 17 Aug 2022 03:50 | Edited by: elsslots 
"Thrones" are relatively common in palaces all over the world so I would advise limiting the connection as much as possible: originals, monumental, non-moveable, for an important, named person.

Author Solivagant
Partaker
#696 | Posted: 17 Aug 2022 04:42 | Edited by: Solivagant 
elsslots:
Thrones" are relatively common in palaces all over the world

Agree....but we only have 10 so far so not yet a problem??
Most of the current ones seem interesting and worth knowing about/connecting... ..however they could fall foul of these rules if strictly applied
Goslar - Imperial throne - no name mentioned and only partly authentic. Yet its historic presence in Goslar seems worth highlighting?
Injeongjeon Throne Hall - there is a throne ..but not named for a specific person...and how authentic? Wouldn't be a great loss from this connection would it - it is the "Throne room" rather than the throne which is significant in this case.

We only have a "category" for "Palace" , not a connection but I have looked at a couple of them
Drottningholm indeed has some thrones!! In the Palace "throne room" AND in the theatre.!! Not of any particular name or note or associated with a particular monarch as far as I can see.
Blenheim doesn't.. not all palaces are for "royals"
Caserta does but nothing particularly noteworthy??
So - the problem seems to be to avoid simply duplicating most of the inscribed palaces!? Not sure about "non moveable" -agree we don't want just some small chair as in the theatre but if "named" then this is unlikely?. Nor "authentic" - if "named" it is likely to be largely so - as per Goslar?

Author Alikander99
Partaker
#697 | Posted: 17 Aug 2022 07:38 | Edited by: Alikander99 
I don't think we're gonna run into the duplication problem. Monumental thrones seem to be awfully rare. I've been scanning the spanish list, which IS chokefull of palaces and I've found not a single throne worthy of inscription.
What i've found so far IS that while monumental throne rooms are very common, monumental thrones themselves are quite uncommon.
I think noteworthy and monumental would be enough to constrict the connection.

Author winterkjm
Partaker
#698 | Posted: 17 Aug 2022 10:56 | Edited by: winterkjm 
"Injeongjeon (throne hall) was destroyed twice by fire, in 1592 and 1803. Set on a double terrace, it is a two-storey
structure supported on four huge columns. The elaborate throne in the main hall is placed on a dais beneath an intricately carved ceiling screen." AB Evaluation

Based on this information, the throne at Changdeokgung likely dates back to the reconstruction of the Throne Hall after 1803. I have not seen any information to contradict this information. Injeongjeon Hall is designated as a National Treasure, which insinuates more authenticity than many of the other structures and buildings in Changdeokgung.

Author Jurre
Partaker
#699 | Posted: 19 Aug 2022 11:53 | Edited by: Jurre 
Connection: Charlemagne

Santiago de Compostela – The "Historia Caroli Magni" tells of how "[a]t the request of Saint James who appears to him in dream, Charlemagne embarks on four wars to wrest Spain from the Saracens. In the first war, he takes his army to Santiago de Compostela and conquers all of Spain. (...) Once the last Saracen leaders are defeated, Charlemagne invests Santiago de Compostela with considerable powers and begins the return to France." (Wikipedia - Historia Caroli Magni)

Connection: Clock Tower

Santiago de Compostela – "The Clock Tower, also called Torre da Trindade or, Berenguela, is at the intersection of the Pratarías square and the Quintana square. (...) In 1833 a clock was placed on each side of the tower by Andrés Antelo, commissioned by the Archbishop Rafael de Vélez. As part of its mechanism it has two bells, one, at the hour, called Berenguela, and a smaller one marking the quarter hours." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela Cathedral)

Connection: Coronation Locations

Santiago de Compostela – "After the centre of Asturian political power moved from Oviedo to León in 910, Compostela became more politically relevant, and several kings of Galicia and of León were acclaimed by the Galician noblemen and crowned and anointed by the local bishop at the cathedral, among them Ordoño IV in 958, Bermudo II in 982, and Alfonso VII in 1111". (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

Connection: Destroyed during invasion

Santiago de Compostela – "Taken and laid waste to in 997 by Al Mansour, the city was rebuilt during the 11th century around the apostle's tomb which had gone unviolated." (AB Ev)

Connection: Domes

Santiago de Compostela – The "dome above the crossing contains the pulley mechanism to swing the "Botafumeiro", which is a famous thurible found in" the Santiago de Compostela Cathedral. (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela Cathedral)

Connection: Famous tapestries

Santiago de Compostela – The Santiago Cathedral Museum houses "tapestries by Rubens, Teniers, Josédel Castillo or Goya". (Website Santiago Cathedral Museum)

Connection: Historic Pharmacies

Santiago de Compostela – "The San Martiño drugstore has been documented since the end of the 16th century, always run by a monk from the community. At the beginning he attended to the community and, sporadically, to some poor pilgrim or sick person. But in the middle of the 17th century it was opened to the public and at the beginning of the 19th century it was moved to the left wing of the main façade of the monastery to allow access from outside, in what became known as the new pharmacy." (Wikipedia - Monastery of San Martiño Pinario)

Connection: Legends and Folk Myths

Santiago de Compostela – "According to legend, this tomb [of Saint James] was rediscovered in AD 814 by Pelagius the Hermit, after he witnessed strange lights in the night sky." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela Cathedral)

Connection: Libraries

Santiago de Compostela – The Archive-Library of the Cathedral of Santiago de Compostela, "comprising books and documents from the Middle Ages until today; one of the main centers of the world for research on St. James." (Wikipedia - Archive-Library of the Cathedral of Santiago de Compostela)

Connection: Martyrium

Santiago de Compostela – "The excavations conducted in the cathedral during the 19th and 20th centuries uncovered a Roman 'cella memoriae' or martyrium, around which grew a small cemetery in Roman and Suevi times which was later abandoned. This martyrium, which proves the existence of an old Christian holy place, has been sometimes attributed to Priscillian, although without further proof." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

Connection: Monumental Fountains

Santiago de Compostela – Fonte dos Cabalos on the Praza das Praterías (Galician Wikipedia - Fonte dos Cabalos)

Connection: Named after a local Christian saint

Santiago de Compostela – "Santiago is the local Galician evolution of Vulgar Latin Sanctus Iacobus "Saint James"." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

Connection: Sieges and Battles

Santiago de Compostela – In the "10th century and in the first years of the 11th century Viking raiders tried to assault the town (...) and bishop Sisenand II, who was killed in battle against them in 968, ordered the construction of a walled fortress to protect the sacred place. (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

---

Already a connection, but adding a rationale:

Connection: Universities

Santiago de Compostela – – "Santiago is the site of the University of Santiago de Compostela, established in the early 16th century." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

Author Durian
Partaker
#700 | Posted: 20 Aug 2022 04:01 
Throne

I have more sites to add :
- Beijing Summer Palace, in the Hall of Benevolence and Longevity, there is a big throne of Emperor.
- Imperial Tombs, in each tomb, a stone imperial throne for imperial spirit of Emperor and Empress to use afterlife.
- Luang Prabang, royal throne inside Royal Palace, built permanent attached to the throne hall.
- Hue, in each imperial tomb, a throne for the death Emperor shall be the center of worship in the tomb shrine.
- Qufu, in Confucius Shrine, there is a big imperial throne for Emperor to use when visiting and worshipping Confucius.
- Potala, Dalai Lama's throne
- Mahabodhi Temple, Vajrasana, Enlightenment Throne of Buddha, an empty symbolic throne.
- Sigiriya, Stone throne of King Kassapa

Author elsslots
Admin
#701 | Posted: 20 Aug 2022 06:30 | Edited by: elsslots 
Jurre:
Santiago de Compostela – "Santiago is the local Galician evolution of Vulgar Latin Sanctus Iacobus "Saint James"." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela)

I guess the town was named after Saint James the Great/the Apostle, not some local saint?
-> ah, I notice we have an explanation in the connection which seems to allow it ("WHS named after a Christian saint, only have saints directly connected IN PERSON with the site."), but somehow it doesn't feel right

Have added the others, thanks!

Author Jurre
Partaker
#702 | Posted: 22 Aug 2022 12:46 | Edited by: Jurre 
With my visit to Santiago de Compostela in mind, can I offer a suggestion for a new Connection?

Connection: Holy Door

A Holy Door (Latin: Porta Sancta) is traditionally an entrance portal located within the Papal major basilicas in Rome. The doors are normally sealed by mortar and cement from the inside so that they cannot be opened. They are ceremoniously opened during Jubilee years designated by the Pope, for pilgrims who enter through those doors may piously gain the plenary indulgences attached with the Jubilee year celebrations. (Wikipedia)

This connection only encompasses Holy Doors designated in perpetuity by the Holy See.

Québec - Cathedral-Basilica of Notre-Dame de Québec: "In 2014 the cathedral celebrated its 350th anniversary. As part of the celebrations, a holy door was constructed—the second outside Europe and only the eighth in the world." (Wikipedia - Cathedral-Basilica of Notre-Dame de Québec)

Rome - There are Holy Doors in the Archbasilica of Saint John Lateran, Santa Maria Maggiore and the Basilica of Saint Paul Outside the Walls. (Wikipedia - Holy door)

Santiago de Compostela - Santiago de Compostela Cathedral: "The façade of the cathedral that overlooks the Quintana Square has two gates: the Porta Real (royal gate) and the Porta Santa (holy gate). (...) The so-called Holy Door (Porta Santa) or Door of Forgiveness (Porta do Perdón) is the closest to the steps. It is usually closed with a fence and opened only in Jubilee Years (years when St James's Day, 25 July, falls on a Sunday)." (Wikipedia - Santiago de Compostela Cathedral)

Vatican City - St. Peter's Basilica: "One of the decorated bronze doors leading from the narthex is the Holy Door, only opened during jubilees." (Wikipedia - St. Peter's Basilica)

Author Jurre
Partaker
#703 | Posted: 23 Aug 2022 09:29 | Edited by: Jurre 
And some more Santiago connections...

Connection: Cemeteries

Santiago de Compostela – The "descent to the bowels of the Cathedral is really a descent to the history of the sacred hill (...). In these narrow spaces, previously accessible only to researchers, visitors will find a Roman cemetery and Swabian necropolis with dozens of tombs, as well as gravestones from 13 to 19 centuries old." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Dynastic Burial Places

Santiago de Compostela – Cathedral: "The Royal Pantheon displays tombs and reclining statues of kings of Galicia and León that died in the 12th to 14th c.: Fernando II of León, Alfonso IX (VIII of Galicia), the queen Doña Berenguela (wife of Alfonso VII), Doña Juana de Castro (wife of Peter the Cruel) and Raymond of Burgundy, niece of Pope Callixtus II and son-in-law of Alfonso VI, among others." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Famous Bells

Santiago de Compostela – "The [Clock] tower houses the Cathedral's largest bell, also known as Berenguela. The original from 1678 cracked and was replaced by the current one (...). It is said that if there are ever 13 strokes at midnight instead of 12, the Devil will have an extra magical hour to roam around." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Mercedarians

Santiago de Compostela – Monastery and Church of Santa María de Conxo : After the nuns left in the 15th century, the monastery "was subsequently inhabited by Mercedarian monks." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Nunneries

Santiago de Compostela – Monastery and Church of Santa María de Conxo : "(...) historical documents attribute the foundation to Archbishop Xelmírez, in order to house a community of nuns. (...) The nuns that inhabited it moved to the Monastery of Antealtares in the 15th century." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Octagons

Santiago de Compostela – The cathedral's dome is octagonal: "Hanging from the octagonal dome, opposite the altar, we can see the rope and system of pulleys designed in the 16th century to operate the famous "Botafumeiro" censer." (santiagoturismo)

Connection: Sir Francis Drake

Santiago de Compostela – "Curiously, until the 19th c. worshippers could not visit the relics, which in fact had been "missing" since the 16th century. It turns out that they were hidden in 1589 to prevent Sir Francis Drake from stealing them and taking them to England. However, in the end, the "pirate" did not even reach Compostela." (santiagoturismo)

Author elsslots
Admin
#704 | Posted: 23 Aug 2022 11:39 
Thanks again, Jurre. They have all been added.

Author Astraftis
Partaker
#705 | Posted: 23 Aug 2022 14:13 | Edited by: Astraftis 
Solivagant:
Caserta does but nothing particularly noteworthy??

I think it is noteworthy enough, together with its context, to be added! It was a quite important throne.

Also, another relevan throne (seated on by the king of Italy), and not too bad either, is in the royal palace in Turin, part of the Savoy residences.

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