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Author elsslots
Admin
#61 | Posted: 13 Aug 2011 13:50 
All Dutch websites that I've read so far on this subject stress the importance of the "man-made landscape". I am searching for the nomination file, but have not found it yet.

Author elsslots
Admin
#62 | Posted: 13 Aug 2011 13:59 | Edited by: elsslots 
In all this, I stumbled on something that I completely had missed:

http://ikregeer.nl/documenten/ah-tk-20102011-3071

These are the answers the state secretary for Economics and Agriculture gave to a member of Parliament about putting the Noordoostpolder at the new Dutch Tentative List.
It ends with: (translated) "The city council of the Noordoostpolder has decided on April 28 2011 not to agree with placement on the revised Dutch Tentative List. ... I respect this view. I conclude that there is insufficient support for placing the Noordoostpolder at the Tentative List, so I will not include it".

This also seems to answer part of another recent question on this forum, about why the new UK and Dutch T-Lists are not publicized yet on the Unesco website. At least in the Netherlands they seem to still seek local / legal support.

P.S.: On July 6 2011, the secretary of state has sent a letter to the Parliament, in which he announced that he will send a revised Tentative List to the Unesco WHC in Paris. So it must be at their desks now!

Author Khuft
Partaker
#63 | Posted: 13 Aug 2011 15:56 
Solivagant:
I am still "reeling" from the realisation the "Historic City of Warsaw" isn't inscribed for being "historic" but because it represents "the inner strength and determination of the nation" etc in reconstructing it!!


I found this one for you: I just saw on the French tentative list that the historic centre of Sarlat is being nominated mostly because it was the "pilot town" for conservation and restoration efforts in the 1960's - according to Wikipedia the impetus came from André Malraux (a famous French writer, WWII resistant and sometime Minister of Culture).

Author Assif
Partaker
#64 | Posted: 6 Sep 2011 16:16 
I've now found the topic so again - Are we done dating all cultural and mixed sites or are there still sites unaccounted for?

Author elsslots
Admin
#65 | Posted: 7 Sep 2011 13:14 
Assif:
Are we done

Yes we're done. I still have to look into a nicer way to present this timeline though

Author Assif
Partaker
#66 | Posted: 16 Jul 2014 04:22 
These are the newly nominated sites for which we still do not have a timeline:

1) Okavango
2) Stevns Klint
3) Great Himalayan NP
4) Machu Picchu (not new)
5) Rio Abiseo (not new)
6) Hamiguitan
7) Ibiza (not new)
8) Laponian Area (not new)
9) Trang-An
10) Qhapaq Nan
11) Silk Road

Author Solivagant
Partaker
#67 | Posted: 16 Jul 2014 05:36 | Edited by: Solivagant 
Okavango is Pleisticene - even today minor tectonic shifts alter water course directions in the Savuti Channel. See
http://www.bgr.bund.de/EN/Themen/Wasser/Projekte/abgeschlossen/F+E/Senken_Botswana/se nkenbotswana_projektbeschr_en.html

Stevns Klint - as it records the exact boundary between 2 periods (Cretacious-Paleocene) we have to decide which to choose. I would suggest Paleocene on the "logic" that the boundary wasn't there until the latter started!

Qapac Nan Nom file quote "The central thrust of the Incas' policy, initiated in the sixth century and recorded in millennia of pre-Hispanic Andean history, was expressed to the fullest in terms of territorial spread and maximum linkages among cultures in the fifteenth century" So this latter century seems the best?

Silk Roads The phrase used again and again in the Nomination file's overall description is "the initial section of the entire Silk Roads used from the 2nd century BC till the 16th century AD" and "Having witnessed significant stages in the development of human civilization on the Eurasian continent over a period of eighteen centuries between
the 2nd century BC and 16th century AD,"
etc etc. I can find no reason not to use the first date rather than choosing a date from within the period.

Trang An. Despite the fact that it includes Hoa Lu - the former capital between 968- 1010 CE absolutely NO mention is made off this place in the Criteria or OUV!! Instead these relate to the natural and cultural aspects surrounding the changes to the Karst lansdcape over a much longer period
a. "Trang An is an outstanding locale within the Southeast Asia region and in the wider world for demonstrating the way that humans interacted with the natural landscape and adapted to major changes in environment over a time period spanning more than 30,000 years, between about 1,200 BP and 33,100 BP. The remarkably long and continuous cultural history is revealed as being strongly associated with recent geological evolution of the Trang An limestone karst massif. Early humans have been an integral part of the biotic communities that have become established in the massif environs since at least the Last Glacial Maximum. During this time they endured some of the most turbulent climatic and geographic changes in Earth history, including repeated submergence of the landscape due to oscillating sea levels (Crit v)
b. "The story of karst evolution, so well told at Trang An, is of even greater scientific significance because of evidence that sea level has varied here in the past. During the Pleistocene and Holocene, the margins of the Trang An massif were invaded and re-worked by the sea many times. Trang An is widely regarded as being of global importance for illustrating the interaction of karst evolution with changing sea levels and associated water-table levels." (Crit viii)
c "Trang An is, therefore, an outstanding in situ archive of changing environmental conditions and people's responses to that change extending into the deep past." (from OUV

So it has to be Late Pleistocene or Holocene?? Late Pleistocene finished c 17k years ago -about the middle of the period covered in Crit v so no help there!! I would probably choose Late Pleistocene on the basis that it was the first major period involved??

Hamiguitan . "Past geological processes that took place in this region transformed the local geography into a semi-isolation that is the Pujada Peninsula, the cradle of the Hamiguitan Mountain Range" (detail under Crit X)
The peninsula dates to Cretaceous - "The Mt. Hamiguitan Range is part of the Pujada Peninsula, deduced as a product of magmatic and tectonic actions generated by the subduction of the Philippine Sea Plate. The tectonic collision caused the oceanic crust to rise up, creating the mountain range. The melting of the subducted slabs as it sank into the subduction zone generated the Cretaceous volcanic rocks of the Pujada Peninsula" (Nom File).
But to what period does the flora and fauna for which it was nominated belong ? ("MHRWS represents a complete set of relatively intact mountain ecosystems in this significant biogeographic region of the Philippines."). I haven't been able to discover anything further.

Author Assif
Partaker
#68 | Posted: 17 Jul 2014 05:41 
Machu Picchu - 15th Century
Built in the fifteenth century Machu Picchu was abandoned when the Inca Empire was conquered by the Spaniards in the sixteenth century. (Nom File)

Rio Abiseo - 15th Century
"Stratigraphic and dariocarbon evidence indicates that both were built during the Late Horizon or toward the end of the antecedent Late Intermediate Period."
Church W. "Early Occupation at Grand Pajaten".

Author Assif
Partaker
#69 | Posted: 17 Jul 2014 09:09 
Ibiza - 16th Century, 7th Century BC

The intact 16th century fortifications of Ibiza bear unique witness to the military architecture and engineering and the aesthetics of the Renaissance. (Criterion II)

Sa Caleta - The Phoenicians established a foothold around 650 BC. (Wiki)
The Phoenician ruins of Sa Caleta and the Phoenician-Punic cemetery of Puig des Molins are exceptional evidence of urbanization and social life in the Phoenician colonies of the western Mediterranean. (Criterion III)

Laponian Area - 5th millenium BC

"record of humans being part of these ecosystems as far as 7000 BP" (Nom File)

Author elsslots
Admin
#70 | Posted: 18 Jul 2014 07:51 | Edited by: elsslots 
Assif:
Machu Picchu - 15th CenturyBuilt in the fifteenth century Machu Picchu was abandoned when the Inca Empire was conquered by the Spaniards in the sixteenth century. (Nom File)Rio Abiseo - 15th Century"Stratigraphic and dariocarbon evidence indicates that both were built during the Late Horizon or toward the end of the antecedent Late Intermediate Period."Church W. "Early Occupation at Grand Pajaten".

these both already have assignments to centuries/ages in the timeline, as well as Ibiza and Laponian

I'm afraid you're looking at an old To do-list, Assif

Author Assif
Partaker
#71 | Posted: 18 Jul 2014 11:01 
Thanks Els.
Could you please give me the links to the current list of sites with no timeline and no official link?

Author elsslots
Admin
#72 | Posted: 18 Jul 2014 11:31 | Edited by: elsslots 
http://www.worldheritagesite.org/allnolink.php (no official link)

http://www.worldheritagesite.org/allnotimeline.php (NATURAL WHS with no timeline - so with mixed sites such as Machu Picchu we have a date for the cultural part, but the natural one is missing.

Author Khuft
Partaker
#73 | Posted: 20 Jul 2014 14:11 
Solivagant:
Trang An. Despite the fact that it includes Hoa Lu - the former capital between 968- 1010 CE absolutely NO mention is made off this place in the Criteria or OUV!


Indeed the nomination file has only scant infos on it. While I did manage to find the names of dozens of caves and rock-shelters from the prehistoric era, I'm struggling with finding which temples & palaces etc from the historic age are part of the site. Has anyone else been more lucky in compiling this?

Author Solivagant
Partaker
#74 | Posted: 5 Mar 2015 13:44 
Happened to browse through the entire Time-line today and periods after 16th C appear to have disappeared??

On a similar matter I wonder if this page could have a short explanatory text explaining the sorts of decisions we made as to which time periods we used and how we determined which period a site was allocated to. It isn't all "self evident"
Both for "future generations" (!!!) - but also as an explanation for "passers by".
If ok I am happy to have a go for a starter.

Author elsslots
Admin
#75 | Posted: 5 Mar 2015 13:47 | Edited by: elsslots 
Solivagant:
Happened to browse through the entire Time-line today and periods after 16th C appear to have disappeared??

I still see them (scroll to the right)

P.S.: what browser do you use? I seem to miss the 20th century in Google Chrome

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