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WHS Hotspots

 
 
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Author TaiTT
Partaker
#106 | Posted: 1 Jul 2021 23:55 | Edited by: TaiTT 
elsslots
I think you could keep it as one and just mention which station to stay near when choosing to make the day trip.
Also should Sanqingshan be listed as part of Fujian hotspot as it lies in Shangrao which has its own hotspot and I thought we were against making hotspots overlap with other's centres

Author TaiTT
Partaker
#107 | Posted: 7 Jul 2021 00:07 
Can the prosecco hills be added to the Venice hotspot as trains run quite regularly and only take an hour to Conegliano which should leave enough time to enter core zone.

Author elsslots
Admin
#108 | Posted: 10 Jul 2021 12:29 | Edited by: elsslots 
TaiTT:
lies in Shangrao which has its own hotspot and I thought we were against making hotspots overlap with other's centres

We could even delete the Jiangxi hotspot all together. All its sites are either covered already by the Hangzhou hotspot or the Fujian hotspot. Those 2 (Hangzhou or Fuzhou/Xiamen) also are more logical places to stay than Shangrao.

TaiTT:
Can the prosecco hills be added to the Venice hotspot as trains run quite regularly and only take an hour to Conegliano which should leave enough time to enter core zone.

done

Author TaiTT
Partaker
#109 | Posted: 10 Jul 2021 16:44 
Yes, I feel the Jiangxi Hotspot could be deleted,
Also Shangrao is spelt wrong in the Fujian Hotspot Page

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#110 | Posted: 12 Jul 2021 07:09 | Edited by: nfmungard 
I think the Suceava Hotspot has to go.

First things first: All sites across the Ukrainian border are across a pretty severe border: EU <> Ukraine. You can only do this by car as there is no frequent public transport option.

Second: Transport times in rural Romania and Ukraine are slow.

Doubtful
- Czernowitz -> Border crossing non trivial, but 80km.
- Wooden Tservka -> Really requires a car again and way further than Czernowitz.

Remove.
- Stuve site, I don't even know which one. In any case, this is not even by car a casual thing to do (plus border crossings).
- Sighisoara - 5h by car.
- Maramures - 4h by car to Easternmost church.
- Fortied Churches - 5h by car.

--> Result. This isnt a hotspot. And I think this is roughly right. I would rather see a western Ukraine one.

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#111 | Posted: 12 Jul 2021 07:13 
The Transylvania Hotspot is doubtful, too, given traffic and travel conditions in Romania.

1) Maramures can't be done in a day on what I would deem a hotspot level.
2) Not sure how you would get to the beech tree forests. They seem rather remote and way west.

-> And that already shrinks the hotspot to 3 components. Technically falling below the 4 site requirement.

Author csarica
Partaker
#112 | Posted: 12 Jul 2021 10:37 
"Rock arts" is missing in Catalonia connection. Pedra de les Orenetes can be easily reached from Barcelona in a day with public transport + hiking/cycling.

Istanbul is a hotspot.
1) Istanbul
2) Edirne (lots of daily buses)
3) Bursa (lots of daily buses + you can take the ferry to Mudanya or Yalova and from there a shuttle to the town center)
4) Safranbolu (check www.flixbus.com , possible as a day trip with bus. However, if you like to spend more time there, you should take night buses.)
5) Troy (check www.flixbus.com , possible as a day trip with bus. However, if you like to spend more time there, you should take night buses. There are minibuses from city center to Troy that lasts around an hour)

Other than the flixbus, there are tones of other bus companies. You should check https://www.obilet.com/ . There are also other local bus companies that are not present in this website but you can find them by asking in bus terminals or by a web search.

Author csarica
Partaker
#113 | Posted: 12 Jul 2021 11:04 
Izmir is actually hotter than Istanbul.

1) Ephesus - There are minibuses to Selcuk half-hourly or hourly depending on the time of the day. Trip lasts around one and half hour one-way.
2) Bergama - There are minibuses to Bergama half-hourly or hourly depending on the time of the day. Trip lasts around two hours one-way.
3) Troy - exhausting but possible in a single day check www.flixbus.com
4) Bursa - check www.flixbus.com
5) Pamukkale -- Izmir - Denizli trip is easy that last not more than 4 hours.
6) Aphrodisias - This is very tricky unless you speak Turkish. You need to drop off from the bus after passing Nazilli (yes, you can drop off from any bus in anywhere in Turkey.) around the intersection to Karacasu. Take the minibus to Karacasu from there and another from Karacasu to Geyre. Difficult but possible, particularly you speak Turkish.
7) Nea Moni - You can take an early minibus to Cesme to catch the morning ferry to Chios.
8) Samos - You can take an early minibus to Kusadasi to catch the morning ferry to Samos.

All are possible in a day but almost all of them are exhausting for a day trip.

Author elsslots
Admin
#114 | Posted: 13 Jul 2021 13:02 | Edited by: elsslots 
csarica:
4) Safranbolu (check www.flixbus.com , possible as a day trip with bus. However, if you like to spend more time there, you should take night buses.)

At flixbus the fastest one way is 5.5 hours, that's really too long. Same for Troy. The idea is that you get back to Istanbul on the same day.

Author TaiTT
Partaker
#115 | Posted: 13 Jul 2021 14:22 
I'm not sure if the southern levant (Eilat) Hotspot should exist as it literally states that St. Catherines area is no longer possible due to security reasons, along with that 3/4 require a major border crossing and are not possible by public transport

Author csarica
Partaker
#116 | Posted: 13 Jul 2021 15:04 
elsslots

Traveling back and forth for 12 hours to see a place for 2-3 hours is not something wise but it is possible to visit these places in a single day. Besides you can take the night bus departing at 1:00 am, reach Safranbolu at 6am, spend 12 hours there and take back the 6pm bus. This can happen in one single day. And flexibus is just one of the bus companies in Turkey, there are plenty more but most of them lack English websites, or even a website.

Author TaiTT
Partaker
#117 | Posted: 13 Jul 2021 20:58 
csarica
The two rules are less than 4 hours each way and it must be doable by public transport, the point of hotspots are to provide information useful to travellers, like you mentioned it would be unwise to do this day-trip and therefore it would not convey any useful information

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#118 | Posted: 14 Jul 2021 02:31 | Edited by: nfmungard 
TaiTT:
The two rules are less than 4 hours each way and it must be doable by public transport, the point of hotspots are to provide information useful to travelers, like you mentioned it would be unwise to do this day-trip and therefore it would not convey any useful information

I would more call it guiding principles than rules. But yeah, taking a 1 a.m. train to be back at 11 p.m. is not the intention.

csarica:
Traveling back and forth for 12 hours to see a place for 2-3 hours is not something wise but it is possible to visit these places in a single day. Besides you can take the night bus departing at 1:00 am, reach Safranbolu at 6am, spend 12 hours there and take back the 6pm bus.

If we were to use your approach, Kopenhagen would be in the Hamburg hotspot and vice versa. My assumption would be morning (<4h) to, 4h onsite, afternoon (<4h) back.

TaiTT:
I'm not sure if the southern levant (Eilat) Hotspot should exist as it literally states that St. Catherines area is no longer possible due to security reasons, along with that 3/4 require a major border crossing and are not possible by public transport

Yep. Borders are an issue with hotspots. See my comments re Suceava. Unless it's a green border, sites across real borders shouldnt be grouped into a hotspot. And public transport across hard borders tends to be limited.

Re Eilat: In peaceful times, I can see organized day trips having fast border transit. Peaseful no more.

csarica:
Izmir is actually hotter than Istanbul.

To me, it sounds like a great itinerary that should be listed in the Turkey country topic. But not as a hotspot ;)

csarica:
2) Edirne (lots of daily buses)

I have done the trip and that was already borderline. Traffic in Istanbul is hell and it took hours just to leave greater Istanbul. I spent more time each way on the bus than I had on site.

csarica:
5) Troy (check www.flixbus.com , possible as a day trip with bus. However, if you like to spend more time there, you should take night buses. There are minibuses from city center to Troy that lasts around an hour)

On the same trip I was eyeing Troy, but really couldn't make it work. And I made the Edirne thing work, so it's not that I shy away from a challenge.

Author csarica
Partaker
#119 | Posted: 14 Jul 2021 16:41 
I did not know that there is a 4 h rule for one-way. If this is the case, you are right. Istanbul is definitely not a hotspot. Sometimes from one end to the other may even last 4 hours in Istanbul.
But Izmir is still a hotspot with 4 hours rule.
1) Samos// Izmir - Kusadasi lasts 1.10 hours. You can take the bus at 6 am, arrive in Kusadasi at 7.10 am. Have a breakfast in a cafe near seaside till ferry time at 9 am. Ferry takes 1.15 hours. You can reach Samos at 10.15 and return back by 18.00 ferry. You will be in Izmir around 9.30ish.
2) Chios// almost same as above. Even better, ferry lasts just 45mins.
They suggest going to ferry port 2 hours before departure but in reality 15-30 mins is enough to pass border check. At least it was my case in April. Summer times may be a little bit more busy.
3) Bergama and 4) Ephesus; these two are the most favorite day trips from Izmir. Don't need to go in details since they are in the borders of Izmir province.
5) Denizli is 3 and a half hours from Izmir. You can take the 7 am bus, be in Denizli at 10.20ish. Take a taxi from bus station to Laodikea (11 mins) and from there to Pamukkale (14 mins). Taxi will coat no more than 10-20 dollars each way.

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#120 | Posted: 15 Jul 2021 06:15 
csarica:
I did not know that there is a 4 h rule for one-way. If this is the case, you are right. Istanbul is definitely not a hotspot.

The 4h are more of a guideline. The idea is that you can base yourself in a place and conveniently explore WHS of the area. 4h is an upper bound what constitutes convenience ;) We also have the hotspot as a historical area.

And, I think Istanbul is a hotspot, but not in the way that you can easily tick off many WHS with Istanbul as the base.

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