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2020/2021 WHC Livestream

 
 
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Author nfmungard
Partaker
#631 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 04:19 | Edited by: nfmungard 
Zoe:
I don't know why the bad rep for Bologna. I've seen much worse and they found a niche rather than just trying to complain they are treated unfairly. After all they got "some" ICOMOS support rather than force their way through the council of little kids after being entirely rejected (which we've seen several times in the past years now).
Sure they'll abuse the title and make people believe Bologna overall is inscribed but that's nothing new either. Besides, Bologna is a nice visit and easy too, no traveler will complain (aside from Els who for some reason decided not to visit being nearby and all). At the current 2-star rating it still fares better than many new inscribed places.

The bad rep is that Bologna is in Italy. If it were anywhere else, there would be no bad rep. But then again, nearby Piacenza would be a WHS, too, if it were in Germany or worse Bulgaria. Wonderful city by the way as so many other.

Italy's list is full of gorgeous medieval/Renaissance cities. It makes no sense to inscribe each and every one of those. The "Porticoes" to me are just a way to find OUV. And I object to this very European triangulation of OUV approach to get everything inscribed. Germany excels at it btw.

Author Pavel
Partaker
#632 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 04:25 
nfmungard:
The "Porticoes" to me are just a way to find OUV.

= unique social concept, where citizens, students and immigrants can meet each other and share their knowledge and skills :))

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#633 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 04:27 
Pavel:
= unique social concept, where citizens, students and immigrants can meet each other and share their knowledge and skills :))

Thanks for making my point re triangulation of OUV.

Author Pavel
Partaker
#634 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 04:49 | Edited by: Pavel 
nfmungard:
And I object to this very European triangulation of OUV approach to get everything inscribed. Germany excels at it btw.

In Czechia, we have 15 cultural sites + 1 natural (!!!), and Žatec is knocking on the door, and Old Wastewater Treatment Plant together with Ještěd tower are waiting in the queue = possibly 19 sites for such a small country!
I would keep Prague, Český Krumlov, Telč, Karlsbad, Tugendhat, maybe Jewish Třebíč + our beautiful beech forest(!) + Ještěd tower.

Author Pavel
Partaker
#635 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 05:06 
Danube Limes (D,A,SK) inscribed

Author Pavel
Partaker
#636 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 05:07 
votes: 15 for inscription, 3 against, 1 invalid, 2 state parties did not vote

Author Pavel
Partaker
#637 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 05:18 
Now Gadansk on the program. Norway announced no consensus and asked for postponement...

Author Pavel
Partaker
#638 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 05:25 | Edited by: Pavel 
Gdansk postponed to afternoon of today's session. They need to polish documents. In fact there are still two amendments on the floor and no consensus at the moment, but no additional meetings necessary.

Author nfmungard
Partaker
#639 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 05:55 
Pavel:
Prague, Český Krumlov, Telč, Karlsbad, Tugendhat, maybe Jewish Třebíč + our beautiful beech forest(!) + Ještěd tower.

--> Shrinking the list ;) Agreed. Beech forest I dont know though. Other sites seem to make sense.

Author Jurre
Partaker
#640 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:06 
Pavel:
They need to polish documents.

Hahaha. I see what you did there.

Author Khuft
Partaker
#641 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:27 
Pavel:
Danube Limes (D,A,SK) inscribed

So Germany got 5 sites inscribed this session.

Author meltwaterfalls
Partaker
#642 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:31 
Pavel:
Danube Limes (D,A,SK) inscribed

So Germany now has 3 seperate Frontiers of the Roman Empire sites?

The logic of how we have ended up with that is completly baffling.

I think I can just about understand that there may be a difference between building a Wall, and a series of structures around a river. But the idea that the structures near the Rhine are completly different from those around the Danube stretches my comprehension beyond its limits.

Author meltwaterfalls
Partaker
#643 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:34 
Pavel:
Prague, Český Krumlov, Telč, Karlsbad, Tugendhat, maybe Jewish Třebíč + our beautiful beech forest(!) + Ještěd tower.

Extend Olomouc to the historic centre and I would probably agree with you.

Now who do I see about reclaiming the time I spent on tours of minor palaces looking at paintings of hunting dogs :)

Author Khuft
Partaker
#644 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:37 
On the ICOMOS / IUCN bashing topic - it should be noted that the process is moving to an upstream assessment / pre-assessment of sites with potential OUV with the Advisory Bodies, followed then by actual nominations. In such circumstances, State Parties may be more upset if in the pre-assessement a site is identified as potentially having OUV, they then doing the work for nominating it, and then the AB coming back and saying "Oh well, there's no OUV after all / we haven't fully identfied it yet and need to defer".

Under such a process, one must assume that negative feedback from ABs is conveyed one-to-one in pre-assessments, and the nominations are then only pursued for cases where the State Parties are pretty confident that they will result in an inscription. This would explain why they are more and more willing to overturn ABs during the WHC session ("they should have told us before if there was no OUV" / "if there is OUV potential, they should have told us how to frame it"). We could possibly expect these sessions to turn more into coronation ceremonies for sites, with all the "bad seeds" having been eliminated already before during pre-assessments / upstream process.

Author Pavel
Partaker
#645 | Posted: 30 Jul 2021 06:47 
Gdansk on the program now!

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